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 Post subject: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Sun Oct 13, 2013 1:22 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:32 pm
Posts: 12
whats up everyone , i rolled my rage at the box finish during league on fridayand it was rolling ok but i believe the box finish was too much they have lowered the volume of the shot and it seemed to lack backend (which i know is the main power of this ball) so i had the alley pro shop guy put the surface at 4k+polish and while the ball had a bit more length it still lacked recovery and its drilled 55x5x30 and the weight hole is 4 1/2"> of my midline and 3/4dia by 2"deep
my stats are
17.5mph
475rpm
pap 4 9/16> 1/4^
45* rotation
tilt im not 100% sure but after watching some vids id say its 10-12*

did i choose a incorrect drill?surface?bal hole placment?
all and any help appreciated


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 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 11:31 am 

Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:11 am
Posts: 31
I can tell you that early friction will kill this ball and if they lowered the volume enough, it might just not work with stronger layouts. I have a house I bowl at that is high volume but it also have the highest friction surface that AMF makes and it gives me a lot of trouble. I have to play that house deep inside if I want to use a rage (yay for tribal).

I am currently also fighting a problem where I have both my rage's baked to de-oil them (about 60 games each) and now they are both flakey. My pro shop guy is going to take all the polish off, see if it blocked the oil from getting out, then reset them. Please note that I had not lost any significant reaction at the point I had them baked but since the game count was high I didn't want to saturate them either.

If none of the above works, I am going to have them taken down to 360 and reset to box. If that doesn't work, well then I guess they go into the closet and I go back to my Tribal and tours (until I see the tour pearl).

Curious to know if anyone else lost reaction after having a pro shop bake (de-oil) their Rage?


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 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 12:44 pm 

Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:53 pm
Posts: 55
I don't know about baking, but Motiv makes a nice product in the "Scuff" that if you leave it on and let it dry it soaks the oil out. Have you tried that?

_________________
Jon Kessinger
PAP: 5" over 5/8" up
Rev Rate: 385+
Ball Speed: 16mph


Cruel Intent x2
Primal Rage
Raptor Talon
Primal Scream
Covert Revolt x2
Sigma Sting
Tribal
Venom Shock x2
Venom Toxin
Ascent Pearl (G/P)
Tank
Sniper


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 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:16 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:32 pm
Posts: 12
I had someone suggest that the 5" pin to pap promoted more forward roll,but I have had many symmetrical balls with 5"+ pin to pap and they all made a hard move left...... So based on my stats does anyone have suggestions on. How to get length and recovery... Cause for whatever reason I get good length and not alot of recovery


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 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Mon Oct 14, 2013 9:42 pm 

Joined: Mon Jul 29, 2013 1:53 pm
Posts: 55
I've got mine set at 75x3 3/4x45. It goes long and finishes strong. Also has oob surface.

_________________
Jon Kessinger
PAP: 5" over 5/8" up
Rev Rate: 385+
Ball Speed: 16mph


Cruel Intent x2
Primal Rage
Raptor Talon
Primal Scream
Covert Revolt x2
Sigma Sting
Tribal
Venom Shock x2
Venom Toxin
Ascent Pearl (G/P)
Tank
Sniper


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 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 7:56 am 

Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:32 pm
Posts: 12
JKessinger wrote:
I've got mine set at 75x3 3/4x45. It goes long and finishes strong. Also has oob surface.

thank you buddy, my two choices I was contemplating on was the 55x5x30(that's on the ball) or 70x4x40 looks like chose wrong.... I think way back Justin had suggested 65x3 1/4x30 to retain tilt but I don't remember 100% if those were the exact DA numbers he gave


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 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Tue Oct 15, 2013 11:06 pm 

Joined: Mon Aug 12, 2013 11:11 am
Posts: 31
It's my understanding that long pins on symmetrical balls can have a strengthening effect simply because they cause the ball to retain most of their energy then release it all at the first friction they see, causing a real bad snap (skid/flip). Whereas on asymmetrical balls it causes more of a delayed reaction "taming" the core. This has been my experience anyway.

I have a layout I use on "weaker" covers where I set up pin down at about 4.5" but have a strong kick with a hole about P2. What I have found is that this gives me a burnout type of effect on early dry but it also gives me the option to move into head oil to control the reaction at the back by controlling how soon I get the ball to any burnout. I don't have the exact layout measurements but it's a very useful and versatile drill for me. I will try to get you the exact layout tomorrow. I have used variations of this on both my Thrash Frenzy and my Tribal with good effect.


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 Post subject: Re: changing surface on primal rage
PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:08 pm 

Joined: Thu Oct 10, 2013 6:32 pm
Posts: 12
JRDaniels4200 wrote:
It's my understanding that long pins on symmetrical balls can have a strengthening effect simply because they cause the ball to retain most of their energy then release it all at the first friction they see, causing a real bad snap (skid/flip). Whereas on asymmetrical balls it causes more of a delayed reaction "taming" the core. This has been my experience anyway.

I have a layout I use on "weaker" covers where I set up pin down at about 4.5" but have a strong kick with a hole about P2. What I have found is that this gives me a burnout type of effect on early dry but it also gives me the option to move into head oil to control the reaction at the back by controlling how soon I get the ball to any burnout. I don't have the exact layout measurements but it's a very useful and versatile drill for me. I will try to get you the exact layout tomorrow. I have used variations of this on both my Thrash Frenzy and my Tribal with good effect.

ok cool lookin forward to the layout numbers.... I am just confused cause I have laid balls out like this before that were symmetrical and had great reaction..so I'm stumped


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