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 Post subject: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Mon Aug 16, 2010 11:39 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:24 pm
Posts: 63
My last 2 motivs (GT1 & TX1) Justin helped me choose the layouts and i love how they both react. The gt1 is 30x30@4 and the tx1 is 30x50@5.25. Both with box surface, minus the polish on the tx1. So im hoping justin will chime in and suggest another winner for me.
A little bit about me. I would say im a stroker, whos neither rev nor speed dominant. Speed about 16.5 and probably 220 revs but not sure about that. All i can say for sure is that my speed and revs match up well. On THS i average 204, and usually stand on 21-22 to 13-12 at the arrows, with a break point around 7 usually arching around the last range finder. I welcome all advice and hope to get it punched up this week.

Thanks to all of motivnation, and i cant wait to hear your responses.


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 12:04 am 

Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:43 pm
Posts: 1698
Location: Rochester NY
For something strong and a bit different than what you have, do a 50x70@4.25". You will probably need a hole, throw it first to figure out whether to place it P2 or P3 depending on how it rolls.

It should end up earlier and stronger overall than the GT, it may like a touch with 1k Abralon to really open up the lane for you.


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 12:57 am 

Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:24 pm
Posts: 63
Ive been bowling for three to four years now, and have had a variety of balls, listed in order by oldest to newest.

Cherry vibe, black widow pearl, and burn
Invasion
Slingshot- drilled 3 3/8" stacked leverage (first and only 300)
Sx1- 30x40@5 weight hole 2" below pap on val
Tr2- length and leverage, but just plugged it and looking for a layout that wont burn up on ths
Gt1- 30x30@4 real smooth and arcy
Tx1- 30x50@5.25 p3 hole reads mids w/ a great backend

All these balls had the pin up above the fingers, and no matter how dry the lanes may be, i just dont have the hand and/or confidence to play inside of 3rd arrow and open up the lane. Im really wanting a strong pin down layout, that will allow not only this, but give me something that will give me a decent look on some of the longer PBAX patterns that i play, like shark, and scorpion.

Oh yeah, btw my pap is 4 13/16 right and 1" up.

Thanks again,
Sean


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 1:06 am 

Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:24 pm
Posts: 63
Justin, i'm so glad u saw this thread, because i've had nothing but success with your suggested layouts and weight holes. Do you know where that would put the pin with that layout? I'm thinking with that 70* val angle the pin would more than likely be below the fingers right? I sure hope so, as if u read my earlier post it explains how i've never thrown a pin down ball.
Thanks


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 8:48 am 

Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:43 pm
Posts: 1698
Location: Rochester NY
Yes, it will end up being pin down. It is a similar but slightly stronger version of the layout I used on the pin down Cruel in my video.


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:01 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:24 pm
Posts: 63
Justin correct me if I'm wrong... With Mo's Gradient Balance line od weight holes, You taught me that on a symmetrical ball, the PSA will usually end up being about 1" below the drilled thumbhole. Then you would draw an imaginary line from that PSA to my PAP and space out the 4 holes equal distances apart from each other with P1 being on my axis point, and P4 being the PSA (1" below thumbhole). Is this correct so far???

Then for asymmetric balls, again correct me if I'm wrong... The only difference would be that the MB would be the PSA in this case, therefore making the marked MB the P4 location and the rest remains the same with P1 on axis point and P2 and P3 equal distances apart?

So I'm gonna be having my driller punch it up tomorrow, and I'm excited as the ball that came in is a low 15lber. weighing in precisely at 15lbs. 1oz. with a 3.3" pin. I was hoping for a longer pin, since I've never owned such a ball, but I'm sure I'll enjoy this new release. I'm especially looking forward to my first hybrid cover.


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:07 pm 

Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:24 pm
Posts: 63
For anyone that has ever owned or thrown a Storm Hyroad, how does it compare to the Cruel???

I love the fact that Motiv added an asymmetrical hybrid to their already first class lineup. But I was considering the Hyroad before, as it has already been a very successful ball that has been loved all over and has imparted a major craze to be one of the most versatile balls ever.

Can anyone give a first hand comparison to these two balls?


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 7:28 pm 

Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:43 pm
Posts: 1698
Location: Rochester NY
strimmed wrote:
Justin correct me if I'm wrong... With Mo's Gradient Balance line od weight holes, You taught me that on a symmetrical ball, the PSA will usually end up being about 1" below the drilled thumbhole. Then you would draw an imaginary line from that PSA to my PAP and space out the 4 holes equal distances apart from each other with P1 being on my axis point, and P4 being the PSA (1" below thumbhole). Is this correct so far???

Then for asymmetric balls, again correct me if I'm wrong... The only difference would be that the MB would be the PSA in this case, therefore making the marked MB the P4 location and the rest remains the same with P1 on axis point and P2 and P3 equal distances apart?



You are correct on both.

The only trick is on symmetrical balls, you never really use a P4. Right next to the thumb is generally the strongest position you'll need to use. Call it P3.5.




strimmed wrote:
For anyone that has ever owned or thrown a Storm Hyroad, how does it compare to the Cruel???

I love the fact that Motiv added an asymmetrical hybrid to their already first class lineup. But I was considering the Hyroad before, as it has already been a very successful ball that has been loved all over and has imparted a major craze to be one of the most versatile balls ever.

Can anyone give a first hand comparison to these two balls?


In the spring before I hooked up with Motiv I had 2 HyRoads. One was drilled with the pin above the ring that refused to carry a 10 pin, and one with the popular pin under ring kicked out with a low hole that rolled very good. In comparison to the Cruel, I would place it a few boards weaker overall and a bit more angular at the spot. The Cruel is more readable, hooks more, and hits harder. As someone a bit rev dominant I didn't match up with many of the non-particle Storm balls, but the HyRoad was decent. For me the problem with Storm was leaving more 9 pins than anything because they read friction so hard.


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Tue Aug 17, 2010 11:18 pm 

Joined: Mon Sep 28, 2009 10:29 pm
Posts: 304
Location: Massillon, OH
Justin you just articulated why I switched to Motiv. HAHA.

_________________
Motiv Staff


RX1s 60x6x70
QZ2 1 inch pin to pap
Thrash 1 inch pin to pap
QZ2 BACKDRAFT 60x5x65
TZ3 70x5.5x30
Primal Impulse 90x3.5x55
Primal Impulse 75x5.5x40
Sigma Tour 80x5.5x40
Raptor Attack 95x5.25x30
Raptor P7 45x4.5x30 P1

More not listed!!!


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 Post subject: Re: NEED ADVICE PUNCHING UP MY CRUEL...
PostPosted: Wed Aug 18, 2010 12:22 am 

Joined: Mon Apr 12, 2010 12:24 pm
Posts: 63
Thank u again. So in short, try the layout u suggested, and throw it first before deciding on where to put the weighthole? Do u think even with this strong layout, i will still be able to throw it on my ths league, without it burning up and rolling out? I do need it for the longer patterns as well, but my main objective and priority is to help my team win our regular ths leagues. Is this still a good layout for this objective?


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