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badbeard
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Post subject: ball motion  Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 8:51 pm |
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:12 pm
Posts: 112
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if I drill a ball 10x 33/8 x50 and it seams to roll early and not roll out and not need a lot of surface. what would drilling a ball 40 x 3/38x 20 to the shape of the shot .what about 30 /3/3/8 x30 they all have the same total sum of the angles and the same pin distance .
_________________
speed dom 18 at pin deck
rev 180-210
tilt 13
ro 40-50
PAP 4 1/2 X 1 1/2 Up
sweet spot
45/3.25/30 asym
50/3.25/25 sym
Rap Attack 60/4/40
Sig tour 45/3.25/25 obf
Primal t4 55/ 4.75/45
Rap 55/3/25 + p3
Primal Im 45x 3.375 x 40 wi hole
Thrash 50x4.25x35
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plamormick
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Post subject: Re: ball motion Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 9:45 pm |
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Joined: Wed Sep 22, 2010 12:14 am
Posts: 771
Location: Iowa Falls, IA
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if you are specifically talking about asymmetrical core balls, the angles are very, very important.
The drill angle, usually expressed as the first number in the string when describing a layout, will control how quickly the core will spin to the first transition. The VAL angle, usually expressed as the last degree number in the string when describing a layout, will control how quickly the ball will respond when it encounters friction (usually, hopefully at the end of the lane.)
The pin distance will control how long the ball will hold tilt. You can see a very good explanation of this whole process in an earlier thread, as explained by the master JustinWi.
Hope this helps somewhat.
Remember, you control a majority of the reaction shape by the surface (sanded, what grit, polished, etc.)
_________________
Lane 13 Pro Shop, Iowa Falls, IA ............. * Recon
Proprietor, Pla-Mor Bowl ......................... Thrash Frenzy.
Vise Grips Amateur Staff ..........................
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JustinWi
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Post subject: Re: ball motion Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:02 pm |
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Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:43 pm
Posts: 1688
Location: Rochester NY
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You really wouldn't want to drill a ball 10x50@3 3/8" because of the almost non-existent drilling angle resulting in the PSA being placed in close proximity of the PAP. You could end up with a ball that flares next to nothing because the PAP latches onto a small diameter RG contour around the PSA.
As you start to adjust the VAL angles and drilling angles, you change where and how quickly the transitions happen. Drilling angle helps impact when the first transition happens, but surface is the primary determinant of when this happens. Diff ratios set the amount of time between the first and second transition. This doesn't change unless you modify the holes, and is impacted by the angle ratios, but they do not have a linear relationship.
You simply can't analyze ball motion based on one factor. Like coverstock design, the individual factors are all interdependent. It is truly a careful balancing act.
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badbeard
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Post subject: Re: ball motion Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:24 pm |
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:12 pm
Posts: 112
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the reason i asked is because when 1 tighten the angels on bowling balls for myself i don't have to dull the surface of the ball just to get it so slow down enough to turn the corner. 10 x 50 was used on a Track 607 A I used it to play inside standing 40 across 20 at nations with the box finish. I had a 900 global Bank 30 x 30 that worked great at 2000 i thought it was more the self righting core then the small angels . most of the super cover type balls i have the cover down to 360 grit with a little polish I am very speed dominant. so i was looking for more understanding. it is easy to drill for some one who is rev dominant or matched. so question is
10x50 = what shape compared to 40x20 and 30 x 30 all with the same pin to pap ?
_________________
speed dom 18 at pin deck
rev 180-210
tilt 13
ro 40-50
PAP 4 1/2 X 1 1/2 Up
sweet spot
45/3.25/30 asym
50/3.25/25 sym
Rap Attack 60/4/40
Sig tour 45/3.25/25 obf
Primal t4 55/ 4.75/45
Rap 55/3/25 + p3
Primal Im 45x 3.375 x 40 wi hole
Thrash 50x4.25x35
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JustinWi
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Post subject: Re: ball motion Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 10:42 pm |
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Joined: Thu Aug 27, 2009 10:43 pm
Posts: 1688
Location: Rochester NY
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The only reason that 10* drilling angle worked out on a 607a is because the intermediate differential isn't high enough to classify it as a true asymmetric, it will still spin to the thumb.
With those small adjustments you aren't going to see a ton of difference, especially if you are so very speed dominant. Balls simply like to go straight for you.
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badbeard
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Post subject: Re: ball motion Posted: Mon Aug 01, 2011 11:12 pm |
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Joined: Sun Jul 10, 2011 5:12 pm
Posts: 112
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Trying to get motivated have my Primal and Raptor both per Justin
layout suggestions just working the surface out now. looking to scoring big with them as soon as i get the surface right for me and the lanes. and no neither of these balls have the small angels I have been talking about. I want to sell lots of motiv balls so i am trying to get mine right so I can show just how great these balls are.
_________________
speed dom 18 at pin deck
rev 180-210
tilt 13
ro 40-50
PAP 4 1/2 X 1 1/2 Up
sweet spot
45/3.25/30 asym
50/3.25/25 sym
Rap Attack 60/4/40
Sig tour 45/3.25/25 obf
Primal t4 55/ 4.75/45
Rap 55/3/25 + p3
Primal Im 45x 3.375 x 40 wi hole
Thrash 50x4.25x35
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